Brian McLaren is a best-selling author, pastor, activist, and avid outdoorsman. He talks with Tony about kayak fishing, taking his kids to a mucky swamp, how the wisdom of God is woven into the natural world, foolish politicians and the environmental crisis, how we can actually love the earth, how he sees the face of the divine in every living thing, having permission to doubt, and more.

Find Brian and his work at brianmclaren.net.